Monumental Moment in Montessori

00:00:03:17 – 00:00:13:07
Nicole
Welcome to Educating the Human Potential. The podcast about optimizing education for a better society through a montessori lens. My name is Nicole Coman

00:00:13:09 – 00:00:40:18
Biff
I’m Biff Maier And today we have, actually a group that we’re going to talk with. But the leader of this group is Denise Monnier and, she’s a long time parent and leader and has been doing a whole lot of work with the Montessori Public Policy Institute, and they have some pretty exciting developments that they’ve been working on.

00:00:40:20 – 00:00:59:15
Biff
Building a collaboration with the American Montessori Society and the Association Montessori International. And, so we want to talk to them about that, but there are some other folks that are joining Denise, so why don’t we ask them to introduce themselves?

00:00:59:20 – 00:01:17:21
Mary Beth
Hi, I’m Mary Beth McCormick. I’ve also am the Ohio representative for MPP, and I currently work in the public sector in the public Montessori world, and I’m currently working for the Cleveland Metropolitan School District at an AMS accredited school.

00:01:17:23 – 00:01:36:03
Lisa
Afternoon. Doctor Lisa Roy, executive director for the Colorado Department of Early Childhood, and we are responsible for our universal preschool program, licensing, quality, professional development, and working with partners both locally and nationally. Thank you.

00:01:36:05 – 00:01:51:09
Nicole
Welcome everyone. So this is a historic moment for Montessori education. Can you guys tell us a little bit about the creation of this national curriculum and where the brainchild of it all. Can you share that with us?

00:01:51:11 – 00:02:13:06
Denise
Absolutely. I can do that. Thank you so much for having us. And apologies for bringing my friends, but I felt like they would really enrich the conversation. But but the Montessori Public Policy Initiative, which is the organization that I represent. And thank you for the lovely introduction, but I do want to add that I am a montessori alumni and I feel like a lot.

00:02:13:08 – 00:02:14:16
Biff
I didn’t know that.

00:02:14:17 – 00:02:34:05
Denise
Yeah, I know, and that’s fine. But a lot of the passion that I bring to this advocacy work is because I had that experience. And I can see how it affected my life and, and who I am as an adult. And it really drives a lot of the work that I do. And so I just wanted to share that.

00:02:34:07 – 00:03:07:18
Denise
But but back to the Montessori, curriculum release. It’s the US national Montessori curriculum. It was actually for organizations that are collaborating. It’s obviously we are the instigators of this and also the project managers. But then between the American Montessori Society and the Association Montessori Internationale of the United States, which are the two parent organizations for MPP, and then am I USA’s parent organization, am I international?

00:03:07:18 – 00:03:28:06
Denise
We are all working together on this project, and the reason that we came up with the idea is because we are a very small shop at MPP. We are two staff. We are supported by an incredibly generous with their time. Governing board and then also from AMS and Ami. But essentially the work is the two of us.

00:03:28:06 – 00:03:52:11
Denise
And so it’s 50 states and the federal government and the different agencies in every state. And I will complement Colorado for having a singular, at least early childhood agency. But many of the states don’t have that much unification at the top. And so we are looking at all these different agencies and all these different regulations that may be requiring a curriculum approval of some sort.

00:03:52:15 – 00:04:23:06
Denise
And every time we have to write an alignment of hundreds of requirements and then align it to am I philosophical and pedagogical base and then AMS philosophical and pedagogical base, and sometimes we also have to include the Montessori Accreditation Council for Teacher Education, because sometimes those requirements are written as teacher focused. And so you can imagine that that really multiplies up to a lot of work for all of those states and all of those agencies.

00:04:23:06 – 00:05:02:15
Denise
And we had this idea both from reading what we are doing and from how much work it is, that it would be so great if these organizations, AMS and Army, who are really the pedagogical standard bearers for Montessori globally, would come together and articulate what we were seeing. And that is that is really Montessori everywhere, and that there can be a high level description of who we are as educators that can be shared with policymakers, shared with advocates to make it easier to communicate who we are and what we do as an educational community.

00:05:02:17 – 00:05:25:16
Denise
And so we went to those organizations and literally just asked them if they would be willing to embark on this journey with us. And lo and behold, they all thought it was a great idea. And so we’ve been meeting for it’s literally almost two years as a planning committee. We had a steering committee made up of, you know, the leadership from all the different organizations.

00:05:25:17 – 00:05:47:14
Denise
And together, you know, we agreed on how we would do the project. We agreed on who would write the curriculum, which is, of course, teacher educator experts from both backgrounds. And we agreed on sort of like a loose format for the way it would take shape. Anyone who knows anything about Montessori knows you can’t just, like, nail that baby down.

00:05:47:16 – 00:06:10:21
Denise
You really have to let those teachers and those experts share that incredibly inspiring knowledge that they bring to their classrooms every day in the way that they know it. And so that’s been been the work up until now. And we are on the brink of being able to publish, the first plan of development, which is ages zero through six by the end of this calendar year.

00:06:10:21 – 00:06:20:22
Denise
So we are excited about it. And we are also excited that it will be a free, open source resource for all advocates and policy makers to use.

00:06:21:00 – 00:06:26:13
Biff
Yeah, that’s fantastic that it’s going to be open source. I really I think that’s fantastic.

00:06:26:15 – 00:06:32:18
Denise
I will say that decision was driven by AMS and am I and am I USA to have it be open?

00:06:32:20 – 00:06:36:22
Biff
You would have you would have charged for it if you could have gotten away with it. No, no.

00:06:36:23 – 00:06:51:03
Denise
No, I mean that would have been great. We could certainly use the funding if anyone’s feeling like a donation, but but no, I think it’s in the spirit of of what Montessori education stands for. Right? It’s about the children, not about a business.

00:06:51:05 – 00:07:24:06
Biff
So, you know, my curiosity is, that you’re starting with, with early childhood and I think, you know, most of the most of the, conflict resolution that has happened in curriculum development, I think are in curriculum. Documentation has been at the elementary level. So I’m, I’m wondering whether, first of all, is that in the cards for the next step to develop the elementary level?

00:07:24:08 – 00:07:26:14
Biff
I’ll let you answer that one first.

00:07:26:16 – 00:07:58:10
Denise
Yes. This will be a much shorter answer. Yes. We have a team working at the, six through 12 year old plane. And then also we have a secondary team 12 through 18 years old. I am not a montessori expert in terms of teaching or teacher preparation. But what I will say is that there is less well documented writings from Doctor Montessori herself as the children get older, and I think it’s just making it a little bit more complicated for the work teams.

00:07:58:12 – 00:08:18:09
Denise
And when we saw the 0 to 6 really coming into shape, we turned our focus there just temporarily to publish that first part. And also, I think there’s a lot of curriculum talk in that early childhood space. But I don’t know that Lisa’s the expert on that.

00:08:18:11 – 00:08:48:09
Biff
I, I also wonder whether there’s more, more flexibility in a way, at the with earlier ages that at the elementary level, you also are you know, you’re also dealing with the all of the different public, the public districts who have their own, curricula that they want to involve and I. Who, who is the who who receives this curriculum?

00:08:48:11 – 00:09:02:07
Biff
I mean, is this for I mean, for for early childhood? Who is it, a debt? I mean, is this I, I imagine it’s, it’s the the motivation is less to,

00:09:02:09 – 00:09:18:05
Biff
To get consistency across the board within schools and more to, to allow schools to use this as a tool to, to, to define authentic practice to agencies.

00:09:18:10 – 00:09:19:13
Biff
Is that true?

00:09:19:14 – 00:09:52:20
Denise
Exactly. I mean, the main goal is to have a universal tool to communicate with policymakers. There are multiple to many states who are requiring curriculum approval at at all levels, but definitely in early childhood states with advanced universal preschool programs. States with funding streams, you know, trying to support the early care and education industry, states where, you know, they’re trying to support quality through funding, are all looking to approve a curriculum.

00:09:53:02 – 00:10:13:07
Denise
And there hasn’t really been anything like this that’s this sort of high level look at Montessori up until now to use. But it’s really written as much as it possibly can be to communicate to those policymakers through our MPI advocates like Marybeth.

00:10:13:09 – 00:10:45:11
Nicole
Interesting. I you know, I’m so impressed with how much support you guys have from so many different organizations to see this through. And, you know, for our listeners that aren’t very familiar with the various organizations within the Montessori community, I was really interested in aims. And am I coming together for this shared vision. And so I wonder and while you know, am s and am I there there commonality is the love for Montessori education and the implementation for all.

00:10:45:16 – 00:10:53:11
Nicole
I wonder, did you have to navigate differences amongst the organizations to come together and and create this, curriculum?

00:10:53:12 – 00:11:22:13
Denise
Well, yeah, in a word, of course, every organization has its own peculiarities and and certain ways of doing things. But really among the steering committee, first of all, I think the understanding of the need was so clear and the interest in, in collaborating was so strong. But the real money, in my opinion, was in the in the expert workgroups putting together the curriculum.

00:11:22:13 – 00:11:46:18
Denise
I think there’s a long existing sort of narrative that aims and am I are so different that we can’t get along or they can’t get along, I guess. And, and that the differences come from pedagogy and philosophy. Right. But really walking these educators and these experts start to build this curriculum. And of course, you know, they had to build relationships.

00:11:46:20 – 00:12:11:22
Denise
Some of them have built really strong relationships, but it has literally been moving. My colleague Viju Carnaby and I to tears in the in the meetings, listening to them talk, listening to them share how the same they realize that they are. And I feel like that that has really sparked keeping the project moving along. Is that more than we could have ever expected?

00:12:11:22 – 00:12:16:12
Denise
That that we really feel like we’re kindred spirits, right?

00:12:16:13 – 00:12:40:16
Nicole
What an incredible opportunity. And I only ask that question just for our listeners that aren’t familiar with the various organizations. But I just think it’s again, I said this when we started our conversation. What a monumental opportunity for Montessori education to be able to find these two powerhouse organizations aims. And am I to bring this together and want to share it from, you know, into the public sector and from a national curriculum standpoint?

00:12:40:18 – 00:13:01:02
Nicole
I do have a question about teacher training. How do you envision that to be as you share this curriculum with schools that are interested in adopting it? What is the what would the teacher training look like, or is it just, the schools will kind of, implement it? Is it written into the curriculum? Can you share a little bit about that?

00:13:01:03 – 00:13:28:23
Denise
I can full disclosure, I am not a prepared Montessori teacher. I am only an alumni and parents. But what I will say is that our very clear message is that this curriculum is clear and detailed and well articulated as it is, is not a replacement for good teacher preparation and advocates always for teachers who are prepared through AMS affiliated, AMD affiliated or to your credit institutions.

00:13:29:01 – 00:13:35:01
Denise
That is the bar and nothing about that will change even though this document will exist.

00:13:35:05 – 00:13:40:04
Biff
will it be useful to two teacher education programs though?

00:13:40:06 – 00:14:08:14
Denise
I think so. Again, I’m you know, I’m not really speaking from experience. Yeah. But I feel like just having it all there is a really nice thing and maybe being able to share, you know, the similarities between programs like, I mean, there are so many AMS tips and they’re all different, right? I feel like it’s it’s a little bit of a, of just a, I don’t know, like even in the, in the sessions and probably I’m saying more than I should be saying, but this is the way I will.

00:14:08:16 – 00:14:27:18
Denise
There have been times where the groups were like, oh, right. We didn’t think about that. We do that, you know what I mean? And I do think it’s important to see the vastness of what those teachers experience as they go through that transformative process of becoming a montessori teacher. Like, I think it’s a really unique system.

00:14:27:20 – 00:14:38:19
Biff
Well, it’s pretty inspiring to hear about people seeing kind of the greater good and getting over the differences in order to get to something more valuable. It’s just pretty.

00:14:38:22 – 00:14:43:00
Denise
It seems so different than like, the world around us now, right?

00:14:43:02 – 00:14:45:14
Nicole
Truly.

00:14:45:16 – 00:14:54:21
Nicole
I have a question about, you know, as this is going to be rolled, this curriculum. Well, when is you said later this year the curriculum will be available.

00:14:55:02 – 00:15:07:06
Denise
Yes. It’ll be a readable and downloadable document, and then you will be able to purchase a hard copy. But the but the purchaser will have to pay for the public, you know, the what do you call it? Printing.

00:15:07:08 – 00:15:08:07
Nicole
Sure, sure.

00:15:08:11 – 00:15:25:03
Nicole
how do you envision this to be implemented, for example, in public school systems? Is is the idea for this to be, a full day Montessori program, a full curriculum, or is it envisioned to be a portion of the day that they’re implementing Montessori, or is it up to the district or the school that’s implementing?

00:15:25:03 – 00:15:28:19
Nicole
I’m just kind of curious of how it’s it’s meant to be implemented.

00:15:28:21 – 00:15:42:06
Denise
It’s really in first, an advocacy tool. But I also would really like Mary Beth to share maybe her perspective on that answer, because we’re I’m way out of my comfort zone on that question. So,

00:15:42:08 – 00:15:44:12
Denise
yeah. Are you in your comfort zone on that? Yeah.

00:15:44:13 – 00:16:09:16
Mary Beth
I definitely yeah, I’m that’s in my wheelhouse. And I what I’m very appreciative of both being part of MPP and this collaboration, but also being on the public sector side of implementing Montessori in the public sector. And CMC supported AMS, the AMS accreditation process over a very long time period to guess over nine years to get to this point.

00:16:09:16 – 00:16:35:02
Mary Beth
But we were supported the entire way by the district in the ongoing sort of educational, sort of pathway, I would say. But the path, the AMS accreditation pathway did allow us to receive the AMS accreditation. And what is very, very valuable about having a set curriculum like this, as you know, AMS does require a curriculum that everyone is following for this, for the actual process and being in the public sector.

00:16:35:03 – 00:16:58:13
Mary Beth
Right. We’re always balancing these different competing needs. What feels like competing needs sometimes and having a set, published and sort of approved by all of our, experts will really allow the work in the public sector to be much more streamlined. And so this document, I think, will be common language for everyone working in the public sector.

00:16:58:17 – 00:17:10:18
Biff
Is the curriculum written with sort of is it written from the performance objectives, point of view, or is it, written more from a teacher’s perspective?

00:17:11:00 – 00:17:38:16
Denise
I would have to say it’s written more from an intended aims perspective in terms of what happens in the classroom with the child. It certainly articulates very clearly the teachers place in the prepared environment. Like I feel like a lot of the sections have, you know, who is the child at this age, and then what? How is that environment prepared to support the child at that age?

00:17:38:20 – 00:17:53:19
Denise
And then how does that prepared adult function within the environment to bring forth the outcomes that we know are developmentally appropriate for children moving through that age span? Does that make sense?

00:17:53:21 – 00:17:58:00
Biff
Yeah. And then the but the outcomes are articulated then.

00:17:58:04 – 00:18:19:22
Denise
Yes, definitely. But it’s definitely not created for like say a public school district to purchase and implement. Yeah. Like we would still want to see schools go through the same process, you know, using AMS or am I and am I USA as they’re advising teams about what, you know, what does that accredited AMS school look like? What does that recognized?

00:18:20:01 – 00:18:29:08
Denise
Am I school look like? What are the goals there? Right there. They still hold that pedagogical standard bearer place.

00:18:29:10 – 00:19:03:03
Biff
Yeah. I mean, the challenge the most people have when they’re developing, when they’re as a montessori teacher within a public sector, or actually any place where there’s, there’s a really dictated curriculum is that you’re kind of, on the one hand, trying to follow the child, and on the other hand, you’re trying to meet the standards. And sometimes, you know, there are some schools that give you a week by week, sequence that you’re supposed to follow and, and that and that just really ties the hands of the teachers.

00:19:03:03 – 00:19:19:04
Biff
So I, you know, I’m assuming that that somehow you, you balance that when you’re, when you’re writing these outcomes so that they are so that there’s flexibility about the achievements of the outcomes.

00:19:19:06 – 00:19:48:20
Denise
I would just say that, actually, Doctor Roy and I were together at the Education Commission of the States conference this last summer, which is a lot of state officials and policymakers and also advocates talking about, you know, where is education going? And so much of the conversation was around looking at the child. And of course, I’m in Montessori, so I use the child to mean anyone under the age of 18, and what it is they really need and where are they really at?

00:19:48:20 – 00:20:26:16
Denise
And I definitely remember a session that was focused on high school and trying to find a way. It was two different states. It was actually a red state and a blue state, and it was a really great presentation about. They were kind of working in the same way to serve the needs of those kids between 14 and 18 years old that weren’t necessarily served by what would be a standard high school curriculum and how to draw out their interests and serve those interests and help them find what it is that’s going to help them be that productive, happy adult, which I feel like is right in line with what happens in Montessori.

00:20:26:18 – 00:20:42:20
Denise
And so this is part of the reason I think this is a great moment to be having this dialog with sort of the greater world of education, because I feel like they’re a little bit moving towards us, and it’s time to, you know, really open up those, those dialog pathways.

00:20:42:21 – 00:20:50:15
Biff
Yeah. To have the tool ready now, now that they’re ready to receive it in a way. Yeah that’s exciting.

00:20:50:17 – 00:20:56:12
Nicole
I wonder how do you see this curriculum playing out for students

00:20:56:15 – 00:21:11:14
Nicole
will be far reaching now for so many, so many educators and so many students and parents alike. How do you see this impacting students that are neurodivergent, maybe multilingual learners and maybe children with other developmental disabilities?

00:21:11:15 – 00:21:11:18
Nicole
How

00:21:11:18 – 00:21:18:16
Nicole
I just wonder, as people are learning about Montessori, because now this is going to become a household name with this opportunity, as it’s the national curriculum.

00:21:18:18 – 00:21:24:12
Nicole
How do you see this, your curriculum impacting those, diverse learners?

00:21:24:14 – 00:21:42:14
Denise
That’s a good question. And one thing I’ll say is that this curriculum and nothing Montessori in general and no educational philosophy, is a magic bullet for every need of every child. And so, you know, I don’t want to I want to answer, but I don’t want my answer to seem like I’m saying that. So I’ll just lead with that.

00:21:42:14 – 00:22:22:10
Denise
But I feel like what, what the opportunity here is, is to offer the alternative. And I don’t marry Beth. You were telling me a story when we were talking the other day, and I’m wondering if it’s something you can share. That’s about, specific needs of specific students in not not I don’t want to tell a story about a specific student, but but like how you see the effect of Montessori used, you know, to the to the level of an AMS accredited school affecting things about students and their outcomes and their experiences that are not the same as just making sure we know the math,

00:22:22:12 – 00:22:44:01
Mary Beth
And so in our school, we have a very large children’s house program. We actually have nine children’s house classrooms. And part of that is that I know it’s quite a few, and part of this. Right. So we definitely deal with the, the 0 to 6 standards quite a bit.

00:22:44:04 – 00:23:11:12
Mary Beth
And part of the model of a co-taught classroom is that all of our classrooms are then led by an montessori director, a search director, and then in that classroom, the co-taught sort of aspect of it is that there’s an intervention specialist that is also the teacher of that classroom. So we have students that are both students with usually have an IEP, we versus students in the editor.

00:23:11:16 – 00:23:33:21
Mary Beth
However, if you walk into any one of these classrooms, they’re set up as a montessori classroom. You would not necessarily know which students are sort of like tagged for which adult. Because of course, there’s lots of reporting in the sector. However, that is the beauty of it is that all of these students, regardless of whatever needs they have, are all able to adapt and and exist in this classroom together.

00:23:33:21 – 00:24:12:22
Mary Beth
So we have a three age cycle. So we have three year olds that are a combination of of both teachers as well as four year olds and five year olds in the same environment. And I think just to speak to back to the curriculum is that this allows, and I think also second language learners, we also are really fortunate to have bilingual assistance as well in our building, which also just leads you to, being able to respect everyone’s primary sort of expertise and be able to have then this solid curriculum to be able to share, to be able to have conversations about why decisions are made or what we are looking for in

00:24:12:22 – 00:24:14:08
Mary Beth
the Montessori classrooms.

00:24:14:11 – 00:24:50:18
Nicole
It’s fantastic. I, you know, I, I, I’m not a montessori in, in the group here, but I, I will say what, you know, what I’ve learned is one of the defining features of Montessori is that, it really responds to individual children and not, you know, teaching the entire class the same thing all at once. Right? And so the reason I ask the question about students with neurodivergent and multilingual learners and diverse learners is this is really an opportunity for schools to learn more and adopt a philosophy which could really reach learners where they are and and not just delivering to the whole class.

00:24:50:18 – 00:24:58:00
Nicole
So I wanted you all to be able to speak to that. For our listeners that are interested in Montessori and not just education in general.

00:24:58:02 – 00:24:58:13
Mary Beth
Yeah.

00:24:58:15 – 00:25:02:07
Denise
Thank you for asking that and asking me. Oh, sorry, Marybeth.

00:25:02:09 – 00:25:29:22
Mary Beth
No, I was just going to say the same thing. I think, to be in the public sector and to have sort of this level of qualified staff and the EMS accreditation is a real, to be able to see the work of the students in action, really propels sort of me certainly personally motivated to do more advocacy work, to be able to be the bridge so that ultimately this is benefiting our students in the classrooms.

00:25:30:00 – 00:25:55:11
Denise
How great. So just on that same note, though, I’d like to say, like, I, I think I started to say this when we opened up, but the reason I invited both Doctor Roy and Mary Beth McCormick is because Ohio and Colorado are two states where we have our advocates have done a lot of great advocacy work, and there is a lot of Montessori supportive policy.

00:25:55:13 – 00:26:20:14
Denise
And I specifically invited Doctor Roy because she has been a long time champion of Montessori education in Colorado, and her during her tenure and her role, we have had some really great pieces of policy allowing things like our mixed age groupings to be codified in regulations, allowing things like our our group sizes and ratios to be codified in regulations.

00:26:20:16 – 00:26:49:01
Denise
But Colorado is a strong universal preschool state. And I think that and I’m going to let Doctor Roy tell this story. But I think that one of one of the reasons and one of the states that sort of waiting for this curriculum to be there is because we want everyone to be able to access Montessori education. And I feel like I want to ask Doctor Roy to just say a little bit about their upcoming program, which is really exemplary.

00:26:49:03 – 00:26:57:17
Denise
Moved to Colorado if you have small children. And then the other thing, just like, why? Why that Montessori, but why that curriculum acceptance is so important.

00:26:57:19 – 00:27:32:12
Lisa
Absolutely. Thank you. Denise, I have to start off by saying I was a montessori parent. My 30 year old daughter, Amanda, and 36 year old son, Jason. I went to Mitchell Montessori, which was a magnet program in Denver Public schools. It is now Dennis and Monastery and serves children ages three up to sixth grade. So I started with public one, and, it was a lottery program, but I was fortunate to get two of my children.

00:27:32:12 – 00:28:08:10
Lisa
And, now that I am the executive director of the Colorado Department of Early Childhood, I am fortunate that I bring that, memory of being a parent in a public Montessori program with me, but also understanding how the state supported preschool through licensing and quality funding. So, I think it’s important, first of all, to point out that Colorado’s approach to early childhood education is built on family choice and making high quality preschool accessible to families across the state.

00:28:08:11 – 00:28:41:02
Lisa
So having a curriculum that supports the entry into Montessori supports people that are currently trained in Montessori is exciting to me. And the Colorado Universal Preschool Program, was formerly a at risk program, and I don’t like to use that. But you had to have a fine factor to get preschool up until 2023 when we open the universal preschool program.

00:28:41:05 – 00:29:26:08
Lisa
And, it made it possible of access for any family, including our Montessori program. So we know families have different priorities when choosing a preschool and monastery is an important option for families who want to approach hands on learning, independence, and developmentally appropriate practices and experiences. Our universal preschool program also creates opportunities for Montessori providers to reach more families by helping to address the cost of preschool, and eligible children can receive up to 15 hours of free voluntary preschool per week, with additional hours available for eligible children.

00:29:26:10 – 00:30:00:20
Lisa
Our mixed delivery approach is central to this work, and families can access preschool through school districts. So again, Denison benefits from this are many community based providers and other participating programs. And that gives families more options while supporting a diverse, early childhood education system. So we have public and private Montessori programs that families can access. We also recognize that access means more than funding.

00:30:00:22 – 00:30:29:08
Lisa
Providers need clear information about program requirements, enrollment, and how to participate. So we continue working with our partners and the early childhood community to help providers navigate the program and connect families with available opportunities. Ultimately, our goal is to give families meaningful choices and to help ensure that a family’s access to preschool reflects their child’s needs and the family’s preferences.

00:30:29:10 – 00:30:32:14
Lisa
So hopefully that answered your question.

00:30:32:15 – 00:30:53:05
Denise
That’s perfect. I mean, in a nutshell, families can access Montessori preschool through that universal preschool program at a public school or a private school without barriers. And that is a huge goal for MPI in 50 states. And Colorado is not the only only one. But, you’re my friend, so I invited you.

00:30:53:07 – 00:31:19:08
Biff
Yeah. No, I mean, I, I, I think Ohio and and Colorado have long histories of being friends to Montessori. Absolutely. And I think, you know, one of the things that’s so exciting about this curriculum is that it’s such an important tool in the toolbox of people that want to do this in other states, you know, because it can be it it can be challenging because you said there were two parts.

00:31:19:09 – 00:31:40:01
Biff
One is the funding, of course, and that’s going to be a that’s enough of a challenge. But in addition to that, you have to have in your, in your pocket the answers to the questions that need to be answered. If somebody decides to provide the funding, you know, how do you go about doing it? And this is a big step in helping people be able to do that.

00:31:40:03 – 00:32:11:19
Denise
Looping back to what I think was the original question there, Nicole, we do see reduced, negative behavior incidents in public Montessori classrooms when they’re, you know, really, able to implement fully. And so that’s just one of the many reasons that we hope this curriculum really pushes that idea with states and school districts to make sure that those Montessori programs do not have policy barriers to implementing a full Montessori program for every child.

00:32:11:19 – 00:32:18:17
Denise
And not just, you know, for private school parents who can afford to pay for a school that can have an exception to a rule.

00:32:18:21 – 00:32:24:13
Biff
Is that kind of research also included is sort of in the beginning of this curriculum.

00:32:24:16 – 00:32:27:08
Denise
We’re still working on adding the research now.

00:32:27:10 – 00:32:28:03
Biff
Yeah.

00:32:28:05 – 00:32:47:11
Nicole
It’s a great idea for research, though. It’s it’s, I think it would really having the data behind that would really, sell it to other people that are just kind of curious, maybe don’t know enough about it. But I think having that data is because I, I believe in I’m a psychologist and I write a lot of reports for, for students.

00:32:47:13 – 00:33:04:19
Nicole
And we’re always talking about movement and multi sensory learning and opportunities, you know, for, for learning just not out of the root learning and the traditional learning. So again, this is why I think it’s just fantastic that it’s much more far reaching through your curriculum.

00:33:04:21 – 00:33:30:03
Denise
Agreed. I think you brought up an important point to that. Like even though the intended audience of this curriculum is really policy advocates and policy makers, because it will be freely available to anyone to read. And I will say I find it incredibly inspiring to read. I feel like it also offers a parent or a teacher who’s not in a montessori program, or someone who just doesn’t know anything about Montessori.

00:33:30:09 – 00:33:50:15
Denise
The opportunity to hear, like from those actual folks who prepare our teachers what it is that we do. And I don’t think that’s ever been available in such a concentrated way to the general public. Free of charge before. And so I think it will change, hopefully a lot of minds. But that that’s a side benefit, right?

00:33:50:16 – 00:33:52:18
Denise
The intention is the policy. Right?

00:33:52:20 – 00:33:59:15
Biff
Yeah. I wonder if schools will start saying we implement the national Montessori curriculum.

00:33:59:17 – 00:34:00:03
Nicole
I bet.

00:34:00:03 – 00:34:00:12
Mary Beth
They will.

00:34:00:14 – 00:34:33:06
Lisa
I mean, I will say, we in Colorado have a resource bank and this curriculum can and will be uploaded there. And so any of our providers, all of our licensed, home based, center based and school based providers that provide universal preschool would have access and could choose it. We, just require that any of our curriculum assessments, tie back to learning goals.

00:34:33:06 – 00:34:56:07
Lisa
And we know for sure that this curriculum will and does. So it’s it’s exciting that it does open up the door to that. And, I am sure that we’ll have a way of tracking that because we do ask which curriculum our providers use on an annual basis. So look for that data point as well.

00:34:56:08 – 00:34:57:03
Biff
Yeah, yeah.

00:34:57:07 – 00:35:13:09
Biff
Well, congratulations. I’m, I’m thrilled with this development. I mean, I think Montessori Everywhere saw this announcement and thought, oh my God, there’s peace. There’s a there’s hope for peace in the world.

00:35:13:11 – 00:35:29:02
Nicole
Biff was very excited to have you all on as the resident Montessori. And, and he was just sharing with how, again, monumental this opportunity is for Montessori education to become become more of a household name. So, yeah, I love this.

00:35:29:04 – 00:35:49:05
Biff
I actually just want to I, I want to thank you for taking this kind of leadership and bringing people together because, you know, somebody had to do it, and, and there aren’t, you know, there aren’t a lot of people that are in position to do that kind of, of, of work. And so it’s great that you did.

00:35:49:07 – 00:35:55:11
Denise
Thank you. Yeah. Tossed it around for a couple of years and felt like there was really no other way to get what we needed.

00:35:55:16 – 00:35:56:21
Biff
Yeah.

00:35:56:23 – 00:36:10:23
Nicole
I was just going to ask that. How long? How many years did it take from, you know, infancy to where you all are today to, to get it, you know, published and, and be able to share with the community and the nation?

00:36:11:01 – 00:36:32:08
Denise
I really think I mean, I think it was like a glimmer in our eye for a long time, but really three years from a very specific meeting. I remember, after one of our conferences where we decided this would definitely be our long reaching goal, and then maybe a year later, you actually starting to meet with the student committee.

00:36:32:08 – 00:36:40:16
Denise
And then two years almost that we’ve been working on the project, which we originally, estimated it would take one year, so.

00:36:40:18 – 00:36:41:14
Nicole
Oh, wow.

00:36:41:16 – 00:36:58:00
Denise
And so much gratitude to all of the authors who have stuck with us for all of this time. When we publish the curriculum, all of the authors names will be on the publication, so you can thank them for everything that they’ve given to this.

00:36:58:02 – 00:37:03:16
Biff
And you’re rolling these out at the Montessori Experience and at the Montessori event, correct?

00:37:03:19 – 00:37:29:03
Denise
Yes. We have we have pre-conference events at both of those, at both of those events. And we will have panels, we’ll have policymakers, we’ll have some of the authors talking and will really be providing some, you know, the lot of material. And so we want to provide some guidance about the way it should be used. And then MPI also has like a policy focus for this year because we can never just do one thing.

00:37:29:05 – 00:37:52:14
Denise
And our policy focus for the year is understanding how Montessori teacher credentials are recognized within various state systems and agencies. Because we need all of our advocates to be really clearly articulate on the topics. So that’s that’s our side education thing. But really the, the, the big part is going to be the unwilling of this and, and knowing how to use it.

00:37:52:16 – 00:38:07:14
Nicole
And for individuals that aren’t attending those two conferences, how can parents, school leaders, educators, learn go? Where should they go to learn more about the curriculum as it rolls out?

00:38:07:16 – 00:38:14:15
Denise
Probably after those conferences, we’ll have other opportunities, but we don’t have them scheduled as of yet.

00:38:14:17 – 00:38:15:02
Nicole
Okay.

00:38:15:03 – 00:38:43:11
Biff
Yeah. Well, but I imagine both AMS and Army will will have links and, you know, and make things accessible to I have one sort of in the weeds question. I’m wondering whether the Australian curriculum gave anybody a head start, because I know some years ago they the, there were folks in Australia that got a curriculum that was accepted by the national governments.

00:38:43:13 – 00:38:49:08
Biff
And that was big news then. So I’m wondering whether that that was helpful.

00:38:49:10 – 00:39:19:06
Denise
Absolutely. In sort of the foundational planning and the original, like framework that we gave the authors, we used the Australia national curriculum as, as, like a guideline. And we’ve gone back to it over time. I, I feel like this is considerably more complex. What we’ve built for the US, you know, and I couldn’t be less familiar with Australia’s policy system or educational system.

00:39:19:06 – 00:39:42:22
Denise
So, you know, that might be a characteristic of who we are in the US. But definitely we did look to that and, and definitely have that document as one of our resources in our bank of resources. There’s our and hopefully, you know, that I think when Australia did that, when they approved that, it had sort of worldwide reverberations.

00:39:43:00 – 00:40:20:20
Denise
But hopefully this will also, you know, create some kind of example or opportunities for other countries or states within countries to be able to, talk about education a little bit more, be a little more knowledgeable about what it what’s happening in those schools. I will say that when when we are at the miss, the Montessori events and at Amy USA’s Montessori experience and refresher courses, we often have folks approach very like exhibit table and say, oh, I’m from Mexico and we have this policy issue.

00:40:21:02 – 00:40:43:23
Denise
And we always I was expected to be something I’ve never heard of and instead of. Turns out it’s something that we have a problem with in 20 states. And so I think that there’s a lot of, unfortunately, synchronicity between policy barriers that Montessori programs face all over the world and not just in the US. But, you know, that’s that’s uncharted territory from PBI.

00:40:44:01 – 00:40:47:17
Denise
Next up. Yeah, a helpful tool.

00:40:47:19 – 00:40:54:13
Biff
With your massive staff. You’ll be traveling all over the world South international problems.

00:40:54:15 – 00:40:59:06
Denise
If you follow us on social media, you know, we do get around.

00:40:59:08 – 00:41:06:14
Biff
I’m, I just can’t wait I most of my history is elementary, so I can’t wait to see the elementary work come out.

00:41:06:16 – 00:41:13:07
Denise
I want to just ask my guests if they feel like there’s anything they felt like they really wanted to add to this conversation.

00:41:13:08 – 00:41:48:19
Lisa
the, k six grade. But when you were talking about that in Colorado. Specifically Denver Public Schools, which has had a long term Montessori program for over 40 years, and the leadership of now deceased Doctor Martha Urayasu, she was able to choose her own curriculum. And in Denver and I would say most of our districts, they had that ability.

00:41:48:19 – 00:42:18:23
Lisa
So I do agree with you that as this ability to create a curriculum that that, principal can say, gosh, I’ve got it. I, you know, my teachers can be trained in this. I feel confident that this will have longevity. And we do have that longevity through what was Mitchell and became Denison. But we want wanted to outlive the principals initial infatuation with Montessori.

00:42:18:23 – 00:42:22:07
Lisa
And I believe having a curriculum will help with that.

00:42:22:11 – 00:42:23:13
Nicole
Yeah,

00:42:23:15 – 00:42:50:03
Mary Beth
I just wanted to extend that because I think that’s exactly it is that, you know, around this table and many of the people who will end up using this as a first pass, right, are dedicated Montessori. And in order for our work to extend beyond an individual or just an organization, we need other people who are yet to be inspired or yet even know about how students can thrive under the Montessori model.

00:42:50:06 – 00:42:59:10
Mary Beth
And I really think that this is such a lovely step towards extending that legacy for our future. So thank you.

00:42:59:12 – 00:43:00:19
Biff
Yeah, I.

00:43:00:19 – 00:43:01:18
Nicole
Mean, absolutely.

00:43:01:23 – 00:43:27:01
Biff
One little anecdote that I, I don’t know the whether we want this on the, on this going out, but I, I remember from when I was in Cincinnati, and you know every all the schools, schools, individual schools were required to submit curricula and and it was overwhelming for everybody that nobody felt like they really could do it.

00:43:27:04 – 00:43:55:06
Biff
And I remember the sisters, I think it was at Mercy Montessori School in Cincinnati that they they generated a full curriculum that was published, and then they essentially made it open source by, you know, saying anybody that can can photocopied if they want to. And but I remember accreditation teams were asking people, why do you teach Ohio history?

00:43:55:08 – 00:44:18:09
Biff
You. No way. You know, somewhere in Delaware or Texas or something because they were so desperate for some annotated and, you know, description of the content because that’s what people need in order to, to, understand the, you know, what schools are doing so.

00:44:18:11 – 00:44:44:12
Nicole
Well and they’ve done it. Yeah. You know, I let Biff and I be the first one of the first, I’m sure to thank you all and congratulate you on this national curriculum, this national Montessori curriculum. It’s a lot of work, clearly, but it’s really important work. And I’m excited to see that, you know, that parents and educators and school leaders will have access to this moving forward.

00:44:44:12 – 00:44:47:07
Nicole
And we’re excited to see what’s next for you all.

00:44:47:09 – 00:45:08:23
Denise
Thank you so much. I feel like it really takes it does take a village, you know, between everything to put this together. But then also we have advocates working in 45 states, like Mary Beth does. And without that knowledge and push behind what we do, that won’t happen with the relationships with the policy makers like Doctor Roy.

00:45:09:05 – 00:45:34:23
Denise
Like, all of those things have to come together to bring Montessori to as many children as possible. And so I’m so grateful to all the authors who’ve been such an amount of time to this, but also to all of these folks who volunteer their time to advocate and the policymakers who take the time to really listen. I think this is, you know, it’s a really opportune moment for Montessori to move forward into the future.

00:45:34:23 – 00:45:39:03
Denise
But all the the whole village has to be there.

00:45:39:05 – 00:45:47:14
Biff
Well, thank you for gathering the village.

00:45:47:16 – 00:45:50:08
Unknown
And.

00:45:50:09 – 00:46:09:12
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You.

00:46:09:14 – 00:46:12:05
Unknown
This podcast is produced by AMS.

00:46:12:05 – 00:46:12:16
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The American

00:46:12:17 – 00:46:13:21
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00:46:13:23 – 00:46:18:16
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However, the views that are expressed belong to us and to those of our guests.

00:46:18:20 – 00:46:21:20
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They do not represent those of the American Montessori Society.